Also a Q&A question: How does the sudden death of Emil's friend, Amedee, work in the plot? What is Cather saying about a young couple whose love is healthy and thriving and just beginning a family, yet suddenly destroyed by death, and how it compares to a young couple (Emil and Marie) whose love is tragically flawed and forbidden and also destroyed by death? I can't quite put my finger on why she holds them up side by side, and I'm hoping you can help me think through this aspect of the novel. In other words, why does Amedee have to die?
Hoping this is a suitable place to ask a question for the Q&A session: Would Heidi expand her comment, "Wendell Berry's vision of the membership notwithstanding, there is a lot of this kind of thing between women..." on the last installment of O! Pioneers?
The element of THE LAND in this particular Cather novel and the Port William series is a pulsating theme, and I'm delighted to hear you three discuss that. I didn't fully comprehend Heidi's comment and would like that nugget revealed. Thank you! Lisa
I actually loved the writing in the death scene--it's so cinematic. And we finally get in Frank's head, which is new and both terrifying and also sympathetic.
Sean made a George R.R. Martin/Game of Thrones reference, and there is a moment in the series right before a Big Bad Thing where the sweeping score suddenly changes to quiet piano. And I thought, Oh no. That's exactly how I felt moving into part 4 of this book: Oh no.
Love, love, love this book and loved what you had to say about. Like Sean, the scene in the orchard is like a gut punch to me, every time I read it. Reminds me of the scene in The Godfather, where the Ave Maria is interspersed with some blood spilling (forgive my poor description, it’s been awhile).
WRT the Cather not being clear about whether they were “caught in the act”, does it really matter? Definitely a line has been crossed if you find yourself in an orchard with another man’s wife in your arms (like does it matter if Charles and Sebastian sleep together in Brideshead, their relationship was disordered regardless). But I found not knowing for sure, put me a bit into the head of Frank. He doesn’t stop to investigate the situation, sees something inappropriate and shoots. He may be asking himself if they’d really “done it”.
I came on here to say that the scene in the Orchard reminded me of the Godfather gut punch too! You have this moment where you think Emile is redeemed and then bam! It doesn’t shrink me as uneven. It strikes me as an intentional way to create drama.
Loved this discussion - thanks, guys! Heidi's flashlight analogy was a perfect way to depict Alexandra's personality and I really enjoyed the sections read aloud. The 'uneven' nature of this story distracted me as I read but her use of dialogue and imagery is still stunning! I also loved the focus on 'middle age' which is the reason why I hesitate to give Cather to high schoolers. They don't love her because they can't "get' her, lol. And I eant them to love her. :)
I, too, was unprepared for the ending even though there was plenty of foreshadowing now that I think back on it. I was listening to the audiobook last week while learning how to nurse my first baby and kept thinking, “Wow, what a perfect story to listen to in the wee hours of the morning” because of the beautiful writing. And then BOOM. The ending. It was 4:00 am and I couldn’t go back to sleep. 🥲
Also a Q&A question: How does the sudden death of Emil's friend, Amedee, work in the plot? What is Cather saying about a young couple whose love is healthy and thriving and just beginning a family, yet suddenly destroyed by death, and how it compares to a young couple (Emil and Marie) whose love is tragically flawed and forbidden and also destroyed by death? I can't quite put my finger on why she holds them up side by side, and I'm hoping you can help me think through this aspect of the novel. In other words, why does Amedee have to die?
Hoping this is a suitable place to ask a question for the Q&A session: Would Heidi expand her comment, "Wendell Berry's vision of the membership notwithstanding, there is a lot of this kind of thing between women..." on the last installment of O! Pioneers?
The element of THE LAND in this particular Cather novel and the Port William series is a pulsating theme, and I'm delighted to hear you three discuss that. I didn't fully comprehend Heidi's comment and would like that nugget revealed. Thank you! Lisa
I actually loved the writing in the death scene--it's so cinematic. And we finally get in Frank's head, which is new and both terrifying and also sympathetic.
Sean made a George R.R. Martin/Game of Thrones reference, and there is a moment in the series right before a Big Bad Thing where the sweeping score suddenly changes to quiet piano. And I thought, Oh no. That's exactly how I felt moving into part 4 of this book: Oh no.
Love, love, love this book and loved what you had to say about. Like Sean, the scene in the orchard is like a gut punch to me, every time I read it. Reminds me of the scene in The Godfather, where the Ave Maria is interspersed with some blood spilling (forgive my poor description, it’s been awhile).
WRT the Cather not being clear about whether they were “caught in the act”, does it really matter? Definitely a line has been crossed if you find yourself in an orchard with another man’s wife in your arms (like does it matter if Charles and Sebastian sleep together in Brideshead, their relationship was disordered regardless). But I found not knowing for sure, put me a bit into the head of Frank. He doesn’t stop to investigate the situation, sees something inappropriate and shoots. He may be asking himself if they’d really “done it”.
I came on here to say that the scene in the Orchard reminded me of the Godfather gut punch too! You have this moment where you think Emile is redeemed and then bam! It doesn’t shrink me as uneven. It strikes me as an intentional way to create drama.
Loved this discussion - thanks, guys! Heidi's flashlight analogy was a perfect way to depict Alexandra's personality and I really enjoyed the sections read aloud. The 'uneven' nature of this story distracted me as I read but her use of dialogue and imagery is still stunning! I also loved the focus on 'middle age' which is the reason why I hesitate to give Cather to high schoolers. They don't love her because they can't "get' her, lol. And I eant them to love her. :)
Is it Marie that attempts to crawl away? Is that a symbol of repentance?
I, too, was unprepared for the ending even though there was plenty of foreshadowing now that I think back on it. I was listening to the audiobook last week while learning how to nurse my first baby and kept thinking, “Wow, what a perfect story to listen to in the wee hours of the morning” because of the beautiful writing. And then BOOM. The ending. It was 4:00 am and I couldn’t go back to sleep. 🥲
Congratulations!