We’ve come to the end of another book which means it’s time to dig into to some of your questions. So click that play button and join us as we discuss the final paragraphs of the book, whether it all ends on a hopeful note, the importance of the memorabilia itself, the mysterious Rachel character, and more! As always, happy listening!
I didn't get this in before the Q&A, but I wanted to mention one of the most intriguing lines to me: "Remember this Earth. Never forget her, but- never come back." Zerchi's voice went hoarse and low. "If you ever come back, you might meet the Archangel at the east end of Earth, guarding her passes with a sword of flame. I feel it. Space is your home hereafter. It's a lonelier desert than ours."
I love the implication that earth itself might have become a forbidden Garden of Eden, with the angel to prevent men from coming back. I wonder if the whole novel is a kind of recapitulation of the ancient story of Adam and Eve and the fall. And in that light what does it mean that Rachel is the Immaculate Conception? That title points to the Virgin Mary, another of whose titles is the New Eve. Is Rachel a kind of new Eve? She seems perfectly innocent, born without need of baptism to cleanse her from the stain of sin. Zerchi thinks of her as "a creature of primal innocence." She dispenses the Eucharist to Zerchi on his deathbed. And Zerchi's response to her is to pray Mary's Magnificat.
Oh wait! The Magnificat at the end of the novel could be the canticle of the title!
Sean, I found your answer to the question on which era you would live in to be so compelling. The comment about being called to heroism in the time you live in took my breath away. It has spurred me to wonder how I am being called to live in my time. I will have to sit with that question. Thank you.
Hmm. No, there is no canticle in the book, at least not explicitly as such. Though Brother Francis does pray from a book called the Little Book, Libellus Leibowitz, and the prayer he's praying from that book could conceivably be the canticle of the title. We get quite a few lines from that in Latin, interspersed with interruptions from the pilgrim. But it's never explicitly called a canticle.
I've also wondered if in a way the novel itself is a kind of canticle, even though it's prose and not poetry.
And yet even if there's not specifically a canticle included, mentioned, or described in the text of the book, I think the title is richly evocative and suggestive. It points to what is most important about the monks: their life of prayer, specifically Psalms and Canticles of the Divine Office, and their devotion to their founder, St Leibowitz. The title says that prayer is important and Leibowitz is important, even though he also hardly appears in the book, having died centuries before, and there's very little hard evidence about him that remains.
David I’m glad you told your story about your log book! I keep one for my kids with important (and unimportant) information - firsts, lost teeth, play dates, holiday activities, funny or sweet things they say - and while it takes time and consistency and feels Sisyphean at times, I hope it is a small preservation of the little things that make up our lives that will one day bring some joy to at least one person.
Ok, Sean and David and whoever else knows, Children of Men is one of my husband’s favorite movies, so when y’all mentioned it during the movie adaptation madness, I got him the book to read. Well, he hated it and said it was terrible writing... what’s the deal?!
I would kind of be interested in a sequel to this book that involved the civilizations of both planets meeting...
I didn't get this in before the Q&A, but I wanted to mention one of the most intriguing lines to me: "Remember this Earth. Never forget her, but- never come back." Zerchi's voice went hoarse and low. "If you ever come back, you might meet the Archangel at the east end of Earth, guarding her passes with a sword of flame. I feel it. Space is your home hereafter. It's a lonelier desert than ours."
I love the implication that earth itself might have become a forbidden Garden of Eden, with the angel to prevent men from coming back. I wonder if the whole novel is a kind of recapitulation of the ancient story of Adam and Eve and the fall. And in that light what does it mean that Rachel is the Immaculate Conception? That title points to the Virgin Mary, another of whose titles is the New Eve. Is Rachel a kind of new Eve? She seems perfectly innocent, born without need of baptism to cleanse her from the stain of sin. Zerchi thinks of her as "a creature of primal innocence." She dispenses the Eucharist to Zerchi on his deathbed. And Zerchi's response to her is to pray Mary's Magnificat.
Oh wait! The Magnificat at the end of the novel could be the canticle of the title!
Sean, I found your answer to the question on which era you would live in to be so compelling. The comment about being called to heroism in the time you live in took my breath away. It has spurred me to wonder how I am being called to live in my time. I will have to sit with that question. Thank you.
The title is perplexing to me. There’s no “canticle” in the book- did I miss it?
I just realized that Abbot Zerchi prays the Magnificat at the end of Ch 29. That's a canticle.
Hmm. No, there is no canticle in the book, at least not explicitly as such. Though Brother Francis does pray from a book called the Little Book, Libellus Leibowitz, and the prayer he's praying from that book could conceivably be the canticle of the title. We get quite a few lines from that in Latin, interspersed with interruptions from the pilgrim. But it's never explicitly called a canticle.
I've also wondered if in a way the novel itself is a kind of canticle, even though it's prose and not poetry.
And yet even if there's not specifically a canticle included, mentioned, or described in the text of the book, I think the title is richly evocative and suggestive. It points to what is most important about the monks: their life of prayer, specifically Psalms and Canticles of the Divine Office, and their devotion to their founder, St Leibowitz. The title says that prayer is important and Leibowitz is important, even though he also hardly appears in the book, having died centuries before, and there's very little hard evidence about him that remains.
Re-reading the beginning of PART 3, I also found this:
Hear then, the last Canticle of the Brethren of the Order of Leibowitz, as sung by the century that swallowed its name:
Lucifer is fallen.
Kyrie eleison.
Lucifer is fallen.
Kyrie eleison.
Lucifer is fallen.
Kyrie eleison, eleison imas!.
David I’m glad you told your story about your log book! I keep one for my kids with important (and unimportant) information - firsts, lost teeth, play dates, holiday activities, funny or sweet things they say - and while it takes time and consistency and feels Sisyphean at times, I hope it is a small preservation of the little things that make up our lives that will one day bring some joy to at least one person.
Ok, Sean and David and whoever else knows, Children of Men is one of my husband’s favorite movies, so when y’all mentioned it during the movie adaptation madness, I got him the book to read. Well, he hated it and said it was terrible writing... what’s the deal?!
I would kind of be interested in a sequel to this book that involved the civilizations of both planets meeting...
I loved the book Children of Men and have been afraid to see the movie because I've been told it's not much like the book.
I agree with your husband. I didn't like the book either. It's one of the rare cases where the movie is much better than the book itself.